The Carrie Abbott Show Left-Leaning Libraries and Pornography (Transcript)
Speaker: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Carrie Abbott Show your place for news views and values you can trust and relationship insights you need. Now here's Carrie Abbott.
Speaker 2: So good to be with you. Always good to be together. So go back in time if you can to your childhood. For some of us that takes a little bit longer and think about your picture in your mind of a library.
Now imagine, you know, it's either your school library and the church I grew up in. We had a really nice library, big section for sitting around and reading wasn't a super big reader as a kid, even though I was a, I was an A student, so I did what I needed to, but I preferred to talk to people in front of me than to get into book and get into that place of imagination.
I wish I would've read more. I'm just telling you that now because I raised my kids a little bit different. We [00:01:00] homeschooled for nine years and so we have a lot of books and. I have now a grandma, we call it Grandma's library. It's in, uh, one of my grandkids rooms where they can access all the books. And I love books because they're, they're just so important to the education of our kids.
So I'm driving through the city we live in, and I look over at the library and think, I need, I should go into the library. You know, you feel this pressure, like I need to support the local library because when I was homeschooling, we would, we'd go down there and then there'd be reading time. Reading time, sitting in a little circle librarian often with a bun in her hair.
And I'm saying that wearing a bun in my hair. So just so you know, it's not, that's not a put down. That's very practical, especially when you're dealing with littles because you often have to kneel down, which you should. When there's children around, you should get down to their level. Imagine what it's like to look up to people all the time.
Looking up, you can't always see the face to make yourself a safe adult. Just a little tip there for you. At least lean down [00:02:00] and then offer them a hand to shake and then teach them. Yeah, eye contact. Shaking the hand of an adult makes everybody safe and they feel respected and well. That's just part of what it means to respect others made in the image of God.
So I have really fond memories of the library. Librarians have always seemed to me to be some of the safest people. It is like, oh, the librarian, you just know she's, she's gonna be in your corner. Well, the American Library Association is changing that view, and I just wanna say to all of those librarians out there, this is not about you.
It's much like when we talk about teachers unions, we're not always talking about teachers, are we? Because there's, there's some strange things afoot that I want you to be aware of. So. This article that I came across from Mass Resistance, we've had one of their people on before his American Library Association training video exposes how public libraries collude.
This word is everywhere now, isn't it? [00:03:00] With the LGBT movement to quash another new word that seems to be showing up a lot this week. Quash opposition to obscene books for children. Huh? Subtitle, A LA trains library officials across the country, how to thwart parents and public officials, and how to handle the media.
They admit their goal is to change lives of children through LGBT propaganda and pornography. Well, there's a change of events for the library. Seriously. Hmm. So we're gonna go into this because we need to know how to respond. Now, we've had over the last couple years, sadly, we've had people on to talk about the drag queen story times going on, and it's hard to know who's promoting this and how can this happen, or when you walk into a library.
Or a bookstore and you see strange books for children and you think, well, that just must be one person. But the fact that it pops up all around the country is when you realize, [00:04:00] no, there's an agenda, there's a policy or something that's pushing this protocol. So let's, let's dive into this here. So for years, the far left American Library Association, a LA, going through the rest of this time together, a LA.
Has been working closely with national LGBT groups to train library officials how to thwart and demonize parents and public officials who are opposed to the obscene and pornographic books for children and teenagers being placed in public libraries and schools. Hmm. A library director in conservative suburb of Wichita, Kansas talked about how he defeated parents who were challenging transgender books for young children.
So he, this is in Kansas, friends, we're not in Kansas anymore. He started by confronting their concerns with stock phrases like this. We are buying books for the entire community. [00:05:00] It's the parents' responsibility to determine what's appropriate for their kids. We are promoting access to materials so people can make their own decisions, not a particular point of view.
Then the response should be, this is me saying this. So where are all your Christian books? Anyway, when the parents asked that the books be moved to the adult section, he told them quote, the target audience is children, and that's where the books belong. So eventually the parents wanted to challenge the books for removal more than anything.
He emphasized that the challenge quote process is an important tool for derailing opposition. Now this is, this is him responding to this is how you handle the parents. Okay? So the process is key here. Basically this means having an official written bureaucratic methodology where the parents must fill out challenge forms.
They're called challenge forms for each book, and then the books are evaluated by a committee of library [00:06:00] officials. Notice the word committee, which means time, time, time. It's all very orderly and official, but it's completely rigged, and ultimately no books are ever removed. Now again, this is from the article from Mass Resistance, and I'll send you to another website called Safe Libraries.
Isn't it sad we have to think about this? How many places are no longer safe for kids? This is the thing right now, no matter what you think about the political days, we're in some of the wokeness going on in the church. Our ultimate responsibility, I believe, as adults is to protect children. And we should be able to handle it ourselves.
Now, at this point, we know how to say no, and we know what we think. And if we don't, there's something wrong with us in our adulting stage, but children are being formed. And because of that, and the enemy knows this, we must protect their minds and their hearts. I, I can tell you, my parents did a great job of protecting my mind and my heart, and we grew up in a healthy church that [00:07:00] was very kid friendly, and I loved the word of God.
From the time I was a child. So when I went to Bible school in Europe at the age of 19, I can tell you some inside story here that most people don't know, but there was a time at which sitting around a table with people from all around the, the world actually, we had students from all over the world. And um, there was a time unfortunately when an inappropriate, you know, some sort of terminology came up.
And everybody looked funny and I said, what? What is that? And they looked at me like, you don't know what that is? And it was a term, and I won't use it. I said no, and then thus ensued a conversation that my future husband Greg Abbott heard about, because that's where I met him, was at the Bible school. And they're like, well, she should know.
No, don't tell her. Greg will be really mad. I mean, there was this whole thing. And so they didn't tell me. And then of course I told him what happened and he went back to each one of them and said, you know, how dare you try to solely an innocent mind, right? Not that I had total innocence and everything, but I really didn't know.
And I thought, well, how come I [00:08:00] didn't know? But in high school, I can tell you people said, oh, care, you don't wanna know about that. Or they'd leave me out of conversations or not invite me to certain events. I realized this later if I had no idea this was all going on, I praise God for it. I really do. But that's our job is to protect children.
So now let's get back to this. When parents got upset about this, he says, and complained, he said, the library board quote wisely, decided to do away with public comments at their meetings. So, okay, so first there's a condescending comment. We're buying books for the entire community. And then next there's a committee process by which it never happens.
And then third, they had no public comments. Now who pays for the books in the library in your community? Who pays for your library to be open? You do. That's right. It's a taxed item. So we have rights. A library director [00:09:00] in Huntington Beach, California showed the group how she successfully kept the toxic pornographic.
LGB set books for teenagers gender queer in the library when a local woman came in upset about it. So this is her saying, this is how I was able to keep this disgusting material in, in the library. They were able to take off the woman's edge by making her admit she didn't have a library card. You can't say anything 'cause you don't have a card.
Okay, but the key, the library director said was that they had a strong policy, and here's what it is. We already had in place a policy and a procedure and a form for people to fill out. The staff was very well trained on how to deal with parents who came in to challenge the books. They made the woman go through the entire process.
Remember I mentioned the process, and of course, the book was ultimately kept on the shelves. The process is very important. The library director repeated the library, also monitored the local social media to see what the woman was saying to others in the community. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. What really? [00:10:00] And reported everything to the ALA's office for in inte intellectual freedom.
You getting a picture here? What happened to the nice woman in the bun? These are activists. Activists. Now, my library friends. Please. I'm, I'm not saying it's you and I never would because I know we can't make these sweeping statements right now, but I'm, I'm highlighting what's going on with a system. So the library director's message, the parents are the ones with an agenda.
They're targeting the library. None of this is the fault of the library staffers. Wow. Wow. This is kind of exciting when you think about it. The American Library Association, they're going for it friends. They are violating your kids and your grandkids and they're proud of it. So how sad for those who actually care about the public library system and want people educated, want them to know the truth about history and all the other beautiful gardening books you [00:11:00] can find there and everything else.
Right. Well, our number one job. Is to protect kids. So when we come back from the break, we'll talk about a little bit more about this and where you can go to get more information. We'll be right back.
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Speaker: And now back to the Kerry Abbott Show.
Speaker 2: So we're talking about the American Library Association. They have training videos that expose how the public libraries are colluding with LGBT movement to quash, opposition to obscene books.
And there is a place you can go and Dan Kliman of Safe Libraries uncovered an A LA training video from May of 2020 over two years ago that lays out the details. And you can find that at Safe Libraries, I believe. Hold on, I'm gonna tell you right now. Safe Libraries do blog spot.com. Okay, we'll get back to that in a moment.
And of course, lays out the details and describes how the a LA considers mass resistance, for instance, to be a national force in helping parents derail their efforts and their, and of course, the a LA said it's actively opposing anti pornography groups. It's [00:14:00] opposing anti pornography groups because pornography's so good for everybody, right?
I mean, how ridiculous is that? This hour long training webinar. Was produced by the ALA's Orwellian office for Intellectual Freedom, which organizes a defense of child and teenage pornography across the country. The presenters include the president of glad, which is a leading national LGBT group, the director of OIF two local library directors.
And there's OF, well, that's quite the name. Oi. So. This is a team effort. We're all in this together. This is what the viewers learned. They were told. They promoted comradery and a passion about what they're doing. And don't let parents bully you. There was a clear animosity and resentment toward the family and traditional religious values.
They recommend a publicly used feel good slogans, such as You Ready. Libraries are for everyone. And we need to include the entire communities. When you hear any inclusive language like that, that's what that means. That's LGBT. And of course I want everyone included, [00:15:00] but that is an intentional mark on them.
But privately, as one presenter emphasize the purpose of pushing these books on children is to change lives. Librarians need to quote, accelerate acceptance for the LGBT community, IE, to change children's perception of sex, gender issues, and LGBT behaviors. None of them are concerned about how being exposed to homosexual pornography actually changes and greatly harms the lives of children.
No kidding. It's grooming. It's grooming. It's grooming. It's grooming, it's abuse to show a child pornography and to prepare them for an adult abusing them, because that's what's gonna happen. This is not okay. It's not just about words. Friends, this is about actions. So of course the library director's message, as I said before.
That the parents are the ones with the agenda. Yeah. To raise healthy kids. Yes. That's my agenda. They are targeting the library. None of this is the fault of the library staffers. It's one thing to deal with [00:16:00] individual parents or ad hoc local groups that are an easy defeat, but when they get help from experienced conservative groups that know how to fight back with strong AR arguments and tactics, that's when the a LA gets worried.
And this is why friends, we stand up together. This is why it's so important when you hear the continual refrain from people maybe like me and others saying. Speak up. You need to say something. We're not saying stand out on your own and, and get beat up. We're saying stand up, speak up and give friends to join you.
It's amazing how one or two or three kind people pushing back on something actually gets something to happen. The, uh, office for Intellectual Freedom Director warned the viewers of their videos. Some of these false narratives that are introduced about these books are being brought in by outsiders or people trying to corrupt children, particularly.
And then they mentioned the advocacy group like Mass Resistance, who's been very successful recently in trying to establish local chapters, by the way, to influence not only state legislation, but library policy, [00:17:00] you need to challenge it right away. And Glad can help you with that. That's the group. Of course.
So they're, they're calling out mass resistance because why? Mass resistance has been pretty massively, um, successful because they're not putting up with it anymore. She also said that a LA is tracking anti-porn groups, which have gotten involved. They don't want any public connection made with pornography.
They're tracking you, they're tracking your social media, they're tracking. Interesting, a lot of tracking going on. What happened to the First Amendment? What happened to the First Amendment? The president of GLAD said that when library officials are dealing with organized opposition in the community from parents objecting the books, they should feel free to call them for help.
And of course, they'd be glad to get involved. Pun intended, this is what we deal with. We build out a campaign to help drown that out. She said GLAD is especially good at getting pieces published in the media to punch back. You see the collusion here. Now, let's remember what this is about. Children going into a [00:18:00] library.
To get books. They have books that are pornographic. They have books promoting LGBT, and you are the one with the agenda. They're colluding to drown you out. I cannot tell you why this is such a great example of why a local church would make such a difference. How many people attend your typical church?
Anybody, uh, let, let's, 75 to a hundred would be probably a good median size. Well, that's a lot of people. If y'all just said, Hey, our local library, let's just go down there. Let them know we like you and we like books, but you are not putting that in front of our kids and we are not stepping into the library.
But it's not enough for you to not go. It's not enough for you to boycott something that's bad. You need to love your neighbor's kid. You need to love your neighbor. True love says you will sacrifice on behalf of your neighbor's child. I really believe that kind of what motivates, motivates me. Friends, I had no trouble feeling brave enough to teach my own children the truth, and even if they didn't [00:19:00] accept it, I knew I was doing the right thing.
But I'm quite happy to teach somebody else's kid because we need to change the culture. Right. Now, um, the woman from glad, you know, it bothers me that it's called glad. Okay. Anyway, she explained that these parents are a handful of very vocal people, but they are attacking libraries. They're extremists against freedom to read.
Sorry, it's just my mood today. But seriously, they're non-readers. They just don't do reading. Oh my goodness. Then how did they know it was there? Right. If they're against reading. Okay. And the community needs to be informed that the majority of people support these LGBT books and this agenda. No, they don't.
See that's a lie. That is a lie. But they're against freedom to read. Oh my goodness. Dealing with the media properly is important. She explained, GLAD, gives specialized media training to library officials. One of her tactics is to get local homeschools, home, excuse me, [00:20:00] homeschoolers, uh, that was local homosexuals, sorry, and transgenders to humanize these books by comparing them to their personal stories.
In particular, she said, don't let journalists include both sides of the story. They should only include the side of the marginalized communities. That that doesn't just apply to the media. She also warned that the public library should never give in to showing both sides of the LG PT issue. LGGT, excuse me, LGBT issue.
In their programs or displays, there's only one side that must be represented. Hmm so honest. She also coaches on how to deal with parents who organize opposition against the local library boards. Among other tips for library officials, quote, use local L-G-B-T-Q centers in your town. They can help. Well sure.
'cause they all wanna be in it together. That makes sense. The ALA's office for Intellectual Freedom is also working in various state legislatures to do rail bills that would establish parental oversight boards. And other pro parent legislation. The [00:21:00] OIF director said that they monitor pro-family groups around the country to see what bills they might be helping introduce.
And then they formed strong coalitions with other leftist groups in their lobbyists to stop pro-family efforts in state legislatures. All making sense to you friends. And you thought the library was just the library? No, it's like a movie, isn't it? Walk into the bookstore and that nice book seller happens to be an agent from another country and you, you didn't know it till you're watching the movie.
Well, you know, here we are, right? Who, who are they agents for? If you're not walking in the Kingdom of Light, you are actually an agent unbeknownst to you often because you spiritually don't understand what's going on. You are actually working for the bad guys. Those of you who are listening to this show and you're not a Christian and you're investigating faith, I need you to know this.
There's no gray team. It's black and white. The Bible [00:22:00] tells us that. And so in that is spiritual reality. This, this whole spiritual thing might be new to you, but please don't take this lightly. If you aid in a bed the enemy against God's little ones. The Bible has some very strong words for you. And so another reason why I do get worked up and you know, the only time I get super worked up is when it comes to children because I know our number one job is to lead them to the Lord.
And anything that hinders that is a problem for God himself. Right? So the a LA sustained message to legislatures is that libraries are essential and necessary for the education of the community and that pro-family parents are quote, attacking libraries. They also develop specialized messaging to sway middle of the road and conservative legislators.
And of course, they all think libraries are safe, right? They, that's how they picture them. They work diligently to reframe the issue from the fact that these materials are sexually inappropriate for minors, and instead promote them to legislators. [00:23:00] As diverse materials. They're about inclusion and fairness and protection and everybody's right to see themselves and their families reflected in the books.
In the public library. Everyone's a taxpayer. Well, apparently not you, Christian, you non-readers, you. That just cracks me up. We are not against reading. Oh my goodness. I think that's probably the funniest thing I've heard all week. So at the end, everyone was told in this video to report everything to the ALA's office for intellectual freedom.
Oh, I can't wait to get my name into the Office of Intellectual Freedom. So one of the biggest problems we face is that the average person cannot imagine that this is really happening in their libraries and schools. And that's true. Normal people would be sickened at the idea of making pornography available to innocent and vulnerable children.
Right? Am I right? Of course. But this is the kind of thing that you want to bring to the attention of the leaders in your community. And of course, mass resistance. We thank them for the work that they've done and I'm gonna go back to that one website for you. Safe [00:24:00] libraries.blogspot.com. I have a whole list of articles here and other things that you might find interesting.
It's important that we're aware of the crimes, sexual harassment in libraries and inappropriate books and websites in schools. By the way, they're all working together due to American Library Association policy. And one final word to our. Wonderful librarians. If you are a Christian in particular, you need to speak up and if you need help do that.
Go to these organizations that will help you do just that. To protect little ones made in the image of God and all the rest of you, you need to start reading. Apparently we're non-reader. I'll read the word of God and that will help you immensely. Sorry, that just so funny to me. Nuh.
Speaker: You are listening to the Kerry Abbott Show.
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Speaker 2: So we're talking about what's going on with libraries, which is important because they're part of our community and places we should be that should be safe to gather, whether it's in the community or in a school. And we're gonna look forward in the next part of the show. Next half we're gonna be talking about the impact of pornography on kids, because unfortunately.
The librarians and through their unions are encouraging pornography use in the library itself, which is horrendous as we know. And so we'll be talking to Rob Jackson about what do we do if, if a child has seen pornography and it's, it's a big issue, but it's not insurmountable. We'll definitely have some good insights for you on what to do about that, so stay tuned with us.
Take a station break and we'll be back in just a moment.[00:28:00]
Speaker: Welcome to the Carrie Abbott Show your place for news, views and values you can trust and relationship insights you need. Now here's Kerry Abbott.
Speaker 2: So good to be with you. I hope you're doing well. I hope your family's doing well. That would be so nice if I had the chance to meet all of you in person. I know I have met many of you, and it is always a joy to see you in person.
One day in heaven, we will get that glimpse and we have eternity to run into each other, so that'll be really nice. But in the meantime, I want you to know. So important to our team at the Legacy Institute. Anything we can do to serve you or help you, please know that's why we exist. We want you to strengthen your relationships so you can live out really who God has designed you to be and be about your purpose, which is to love others and to bring the gospel into those lives that you have influence.
And one of the greatest lives that you have influence on is your child. I think you probably know [00:29:00] that if you're a parent and or a grandparent, you understand the power of that. And there are quite a few things in this life that we have to protect our children from. And or our grandchildren. I, when my grandkids are around, and of course when our kids were growing up, my goal was to make sure they didn't hurt themselves and to kind of keep 'em alive.
I know that sounds funny, but you know, you spend the first part of their life doing that, and then after that you try to protect them from things that might harm their way of thinking, their thought, their thoughts about themselves that might be difficult or damaging or anything that might take away their understanding of their dignity as a human person made in God's image.
And one of those things. That we have to continually battle against is pornography. Now, if you are a parent listening to this show, yes, we will be talking about pornography and when children have viewed it. So I wanna caution you. If you have young listeners, we have many, then you just need to know that going in.
Of course, we're always very appropriate on this show. But we wanted to tackle this issue because, well, it's an ongoing issue, especially with smartphones. So I have Rob [00:30:00] Jackson with me. He's a licensed counselor with focus on the family's counseling services, and he has a passion for this topic because a lot of what he specializes in is related to sexuality, marriage, and parenting.
And he has provided counseling services through his private practice since 1991. So he knows a lot about this topic. He's been helping people for a long time, in particular, recovering from sexual addiction. Through integrated care that helps people mature and heal spiritually, psychologically, and behaviorally.
Well, that sounds like good news to me. So Rob, welcome to the show. It's great to have you back again.
Speaker 6: Oh, thank you Kerry. Great to be with you.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much. And Rob, this is a pretty big topic and I know kind of a tender one. It's a, it's a vulnerable topic for many of our listeners, not because they're all personally struggling, although many of many people are.
So I don't want anyone to feel shame, but also it's something that we just worry about for family members because images are everywhere and they are violating kids at a very young age, aren't they?
Speaker 6: They really are. I've been working [00:31:00] in this area for about 25 years, and I am still shocked at how quickly this has just overtaken our culture.
And of course, as a a father, uh, I have concerns for what it has done for my kids' generation and for the generations to follow.
Speaker 2: Hmm. Well it says in some of the research from, uh, for instance, from guard child.com, 90% of children ages eight to 16 have seen online pornography. And 70% of kids ages eight to 18 have accidentally encountered online pornography.
Those rates are really high.
Speaker 6: They are high, but you know, they're also very credible. I work with families who, by and large consider themselves to be moderate to conservative evangelical Christians, and so many have done so much in trying to prevent their child from being exposed. And guess what, Carrie?
It still happens.
Speaker 2: Yes. Yes. It's not the same as, uh, running into somebody's stack of [00:32:00] magazines back in the day, which was also challenging. But, um, mm-hmm. Now it's just a matter of having a, a smartphone around or maybe a TV on, or the channels flipping through all the, I don't know, are, there are a million channels you can watch now.
There's so much you can, you can put your eyes on. It's, it is completely overwhelming, isn't it?
Speaker 6: Well, it is. You know, I'm talking to a family now and, and they have gone out of their way. As a homeschooling family, did not have any internet devices available to their kids. And two or three years ago, their son went to the home computer, used for school and found pornography and it plagues him until this day.
Mm. So, you know, even though you can, can do your best. There's still a way this stuff tends to slip in.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So the big question right out of the gate, what is a parent to do? Because this is so discouraging, as you said, people are going to great lengths to, to prevent this, and yet because [00:33:00] we are in an internet society, those images and one click away of they're available.
What are you telling families? How can we help our families listening right now? Set up some guardrails and um mm-hmm. Some response teams for when that possibly does happen, because at first we don't want to overreact. That's makes it much worse, right?
Speaker 6: Well, that's right. That's one of the first things in my note.
I want people to respond, not react.
Speaker 2: Mm.
Speaker 6: And one of the ways to respond is get ahead of this. Think about your child's age and development. Think about the child's personality and go ahead and teach. You know, Christ-centered Bible saturated sex education at home.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: Be the first to introduce the topic.
And I'll tell you, if you're gonna do that, you're probably gonna have to start at least by the age of five. 'cause when your kids start going to a Sunday school program or a mom's day out program or kind, they're gonna be exposed to this by other kids.
Speaker 2: Hmm. [00:34:00] So I'm gonna ask you to be a little bit more specific, because age of five is a little early to be teaching some of the sex education models, even if they're faith-based.
So are you talking about body awareness? About, uh, specifically what are you talking about?
Speaker 6: I am talking about body awareness and what constitutes good Touch. Touch, okay. Safe touch, confusing touch. But also, you know, if you're reading the scriptures to your children. There are going to be topics that come up about sexuality
Speaker 2: mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: That are gonna be the perfect venue for discussing what it means,
Speaker 2: what, what means?
Speaker 6: Well, for example, if we read about Adam and Eve in the book of Genesis, Adam. New Eve. Mm-hmm. Depending on the translation. Mm-hmm. You read what does that mean?
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: And helping them to understand that God has an authentic gift of human sexuality.
You know, that is a part of creating other people and a part of keeping a husband and wife bonded and love and in marriage. Mm-hmm. And then you can begin to talk about, well, [00:35:00] this is the authentic. The enemy has a counterfeit Mm. You know, I like to talk about how, you know, the, the Secret Service agents are trained to detect counterfeit dollar bills,
Speaker 2: right.
Speaker 6: By studying authentic dollar bills issued, issued by the US Treasury.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: So let's study the authentic sexuality that God has given us according to the word of God.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: And then everything else is a counterfeit.
Speaker 2: That's so true and that the power of the truth, we do that in spelling. I tell people we do it in spelling.
You don't, you don't teach 'em to spell out the word with all the iterations out there. You say, this is what it looks like and this is how you spell it. This is what it means. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And very matter of factly and so to say sex is a gift from God. It means male and female. There is a union where two can come together and become one and any other union outside of marriage is actually what you just said, a counterfeit that passes for quite a long time until that child needs more information.
And depending on the child, depending on the environment and the family story, you may or may not need to go further. Right?
Speaker 6: That's right. You know, you want to get out there in advance, but you don't want to [00:36:00] overkill the situation.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 6: So a little information. A little along the way instead of having quote, unquote the talk.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: Imagining there's one talk,
Speaker 2: right.
Speaker 6: There's many, you're gonna have a lot of conversations over a lifetime.
Speaker 2: Well, I think even the terminology now, I mean, let's be candid here. The word sex has changed. I've, I've taught for years. Mm-hmm. Sex is not an act. It means being male and female and you can't express it physically.
But you also express it in masculine form, in feminine form. Your sexuality is actually your, your human nature and that God has given you, and you walk that out because gender is so confused now. People are confused about what words to use. Anyway, so I'm the, the person listening to us right now needs. To know for today's conversation about pornography and we're looking at the human body and biologically it has been designed male or female, there's no getting away from that.
Correct. Even people who say, well, I can choose whatever gender I want, they still agree that sex means male or female. So when you're talking to your children, just getting that clear would be great. And then all the [00:37:00] other activities that are outside of the bounds of God's prescription, you can say, that's bad timing, wrong idea, and you, you're gonna have to do that, as Rob said, with the counterfeit Rob.
It because this is such a visual. Pornography, looking at images were made in God's image and we have such powerful ability to take in images and then imagine what is a parent or grandparent or teacher or a coach do to set kids up for success? What would you tell them to be teaching along with the idea that sexual union belongs in marriage?
What else would you be teaching?
Speaker 6: You know, the, the first thing I want to see happen is a good bond between the parent and the child.
Speaker 2: So good. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: And bonding is the part of the parent's responsibility. Now we want the child to attach in return, but bond parents. And that takes time and that takes energy.
And that is. Done on purpose. So really what we're finding in adults who struggle [00:38:00] with pornography, it's a type of intimacy disorder. It's a void in their life that they're trying to fill with a counterfeit. So by all means, begin with taking the time to express how precious this child is to you and how you're only gonna be building them up.
For the glory of God. And then you can start talking about some of the things that we commonly think of as preventive measures regarding exposure to pornography.
Speaker 2: You know, what you said is the number one preventive measure, and that is intimacy. Being known deeply and being connected to another human person.
We have a culture that's so busy. We have parents not bonding and attaching to their children when they're, this starts when they're born folks right away. Mm-hmm. Uh, the touch, the sounds of your voice, even in the womb. All of this attachment, if you want to learn about attachment theory, that's another show.
But it is, it is so critical that we understand the value of parenting at that young stage. That we free young couples up to actually have [00:39:00] more time with their, with their small child so that they can attach. Right. Rob?
Speaker 6: And you know, you want your child to just know that he or she is loved. So then when you have to offer a prohibition, now, you can't look at that.
Hopefully there will be some foundation of, you know what, mom or dad has my best interest at heart,
Speaker 2: right?
Speaker 6: And this is really about God, right? God offers us sexuality, but he also has boundaries around it. And when he says no to us, we may hear that coming out of a voice of legalism or. Hopefully we hear it coming out of a voice of love.
I know what I want for you. I know how I designed you. I know how you're gonna respond better. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And, and so well said. And, and a lot of parenting is a no. In fact, when God created human beings, he put a no in the garden. I like to remind people because, uh, we often think that's so inconvenient.
Can't we have the yes on everything? No, actually, it's not good for us. At the same time, [00:40:00] having that relationship change to spend with a child. They know that you have their best interest. Also, Rob, there's this other thing about that Illicitness Illicitness leads to wanting to break rules and look at something.
So this is an issue. We're gonna take a break, but when we come back, we wanna talk about the fact that if you can set up sexuality as a beautiful gift that God's given, that is not illicit, but there is timing, there is power, there is purpose. It might make that transaction just a little bit easier when you say no to something.
We'll be right back. Hey friends, as many of you are. Figuring out we have expanded the show. We are thrilled to expand and bring you more truth delivered with Grace. We really do want you to have news and views and values you can trust from a biblical lens. And of course, those relationship insights that many of you find helpful in order for us to expand, we need your help.
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For those of you who have never partnered with us financially, I'm going to invite you into this opportunity. We don't ask for money very often, you and those of you who listen to the show know that. But at the same time, we're not embarrassed at all that God has given us a bigger assignment. And so we wanted to let you know as well that we are needing support.
Tens of thousands of dollars will be needed to make this happen. That I appreciate your prayer, appreciate so much the messages that you send us, the encouragement you give us, and of course if you'll walk with us financially, that will help us in this time as well. So thank you so much to all of you who partner with us.
We appreciate you so much. If you'd like to go to the legacy institute.com to do that, you can, or you can call 4 2 5 4 8 5 5 3 4 6. Thanks so much.
Speaker 3: And now back to more [00:42:00] Kerry Abbott.
Speaker 2: Today we're talking about something that's very sensitive, but very important. That is what to do when your child has viewed pornography. Many of our listeners in our listening community have will say if they had the chance. That they fell into a trap themselves, that they look at it at a young age.
They didn't realize the power of it or the hook. That would be there. And of course there is no shame in, in this listening community to talk about those things that we have all done to say, Hey, let's make sure the next generation doesn't fall into that trap. And with me today is Rob Jackson and he is a licensed counselor who really specializes in sexuality, marriage and parenting counseling, and has been counseling in a private practice since 1991.
And Rob, I know you have a real heart to help those who have, um, processed or gone through sexual addiction. To be free. Uh, I imagine anybody that you work with would say, let's make sure those kids don't get stuck. Right. I mean, it's just so much, it's, it's agony to have [00:43:00] anything addict us. Not just sexuality, but anything.
Right.
Speaker 6: It really is. And when I work with today's adult addict, of course, many of them grew up with the influence of the internet, but still they've seen how this has been like a Trojan War. Mm-hmm. This has come against our culture. Somewhat quietly initially, and then it has just overtaken us. So a lot of the addicts I work with today are quite concerned that their children might fall to the same.
The same tactic.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. So along with building intimacy and bonding, as you said in our first segment with your, with your child, making sure they know how much they are loved. Repeating that and showing that and modeling that as you provide for them, and protect them and be a priest to them if you're, you know, a dad in that role and mom nurturing and doing those other things as well and caring for them and communicating that through, um, things that matter to their personality.
What else can a parent do?
Speaker 6: You've described a great offense. So now we have to think about a, a good [00:44:00] defense. And the first thing I want to emphasize is fearful, anxious parents raise fearful, anxious children. So we don't want to come at this from a spirit of fear.
Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: You know, God has given us a spirit of love, power, and self-control.
And so we want to communicate that and convey that, and not only what we say, but how we approach the whole topic.
Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: But then as we begin to talk about boundaries. And you mentioned it before the break, so, well, you know, even the Garden of Eden had a no.
Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: You know, now we have to talk about No, you know, you can't have a cell phone in your bedroom.
You can't have a tablet or a computer. I wouldn't recommend a television. You know, all media.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
There's
Speaker 6: not, you know, no media in the bedroom.
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 6: That's a no.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: You know, I see so many people taking their children out to restaurants and the kids are, are walking behind mom and dad like a zombie because they're holding a tablet.
Speaker 2: I know. It's terrible.
Speaker 6: They're holding some kind of electronic device.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: And so that'd be another place for a note. I mean, maybe the [00:45:00] content they're looking at is not sexual. But if you feed the brain, that kind of stimulation,
Speaker 2: right?
Speaker 6: It's gonna require more and more and more. So for heaven's sake, get it outta the restaurant and make eye contact with your kids.
So we're wanting good, a good defense as well as a good offense. I.
Speaker 2: Boy, there's so many times we've had guests on this show talking about the power of the internet and of course the smartphone, not just a cell phone, but a smartphone. And really a lot of people are limiting that, starting them at least at 13, for reasons.
In fact, the tech companies are coming out and, and they're, and the people that have, you know, own stock in those companies are saying, we don't like what we're seeing with the data. Showing that kids are getting addicted to just cell phone use itself. So it's not even just about pornography, it's their, their desire to be on that phone, which then puts them at risk for some of the wrong images.
Right.
Speaker 6: Well, it really does. You know, they can be, quote unquote minding their own business with what is amoral on the smartphone. Come on, it's not gonna take, but just to [00:46:00] click
Speaker 2: mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: To find something that kind of teases.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: And another click that indoctrinates. Mm. So we've, we just really can't risk that with our youngest kids.
I, I really routinely say, you know, no smartphone until 15 or 16.
Speaker 2: Mm. Yeah, I have no problem with that. I know I was one of those parents, my husband and I have set that role for our kids and it's interesting because they all use their phones, but they do say, thanks for putting up that guardrail. Kids don't thank parents for guardrails.
Can I just say to you, younger parents, if you're expecting them to send you a note and say, thanks for being so good and parenting me so well. I just, you need to get past that and you need to be secure. Not only do we not want you anxious, you need to be secure knowing that that loving your kids means healthy boundaries.
So that's an easy one. I think the more difficult one is when you, you've done that, you're a good parent, you're really paying attention, you're watching what's the movies are and their phone and they still stumble across it. What do we do for that child? What kind of repair do we need to worry [00:47:00] about?
Speaker 6: Yeah, great. Great question. One thing I would want the parents to be on the same page.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah.
Speaker 6: And many times they get divided early on, you know, and I'll say a lot of times. The dads are just not as sensitive to this topic as the moms are, and that, that hurts me to say as a man, but you know, it's the truth.
So parents get on the same page. Number two, as best you can with caution and prayer. And I underscore both of those work together to try to discern the kinds of pornography your child has been exposed to. And no one needs to look at this stuff or wants to see this stuff per se, but pornography is not created, you know, equally there are different kinds.
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 6: And you might think about how different kinds are, like different kinds of viruses, and if you can categorize it appropriately, that's gonna be great information for the therapist you're gonna need to work with.
Speaker 2: Hmm. Okay.
Speaker 6: So get on the same page, categorize what's been seen. [00:48:00] Okay. And then, you know, get a Christian therapist who specializes in this.
Know your child for having been exposed is not a sexual addict, but I'll tell you if they were exposed and you don't teach the child how to go in and sort of begin to extract what they've seen.
Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: In the name of Christ with, you know, good psychology and good behavioral standards, then more than likely they're gonna be at risk for sex addiction by the time they're a teenager.
Speaker 2: And it's that simple, right? Just that formation of the brain. It's simple. It's that simple. It's that. It's so powerful. And if you're thinking, oh, come on, it couldn't be that big a deal. Listen you, the research shows that even if they're watching a show on tv, that it just has sexual innuendo. It's going to lead to more attempts at behavior.
That's the way the, the body and the mind work, and again, the power of image as an image bearer cannot be understated. That's why the Bible prescribes for us to think on and look on those things that are good and true and right and beautiful, and creating a [00:49:00] taste in your child's life for more of things that are bad for them.
I mean, it doesn't, it doesn't start with pornography, but it can start with other things that are maybe seem innocuous, but they're not. And they develop a taste or a desire for that, and they want to consume more of that kind of content. And we do have to be very, very careful. What about setting up guardrails using like what guard child has?
Guard child.com has some. Ways you can follow the phone apps your kids are using, or if your child has been bullied, you can track that. And there's all kinds of things that you can do to help protect them as you're going along. Do you recommend that,
Speaker 6: I do recommend these kinds of guardrails, these kind of technological bumper zones or buffer zones.
Mm-hmm. If you will.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 6: But I am concerned that the average parent seems to put too much confidence in them. Okay. Like, oh, well we've got this guardrail now we've got this. Yeah. App that sends us data.
Mm.
Speaker 6: Listen, there are so many ways for kids to get around these apps.
Speaker 4: I know.
Speaker 6: And maybe the seven or 8-year-old won't, but I'll guarantee you [00:50:00] the 12 or 13-year-old
Speaker 4: Yes.
Speaker 6: Will run circles around anything you put on a device.
Speaker 4: Mm.
Speaker 6: These kinds of, of technological guardrails, they're helpful, but think of them as a doorknob with a lock a, a locked door keeps an honest person out.
Speaker 3: Hmm.
Speaker 6: Someone who wants to get in is going to be able to do so. And so if your child really sets his or her mind on getting around an app or some kind of technological barrier, more than likely they're gonna be able to, and even while they're attempting, it can actually be sexually stimulating to be getting, you know, some hits
Speaker 2: right
Speaker 6: on the device that are.
Or stimulating.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So I like that picture of the door, the doorknob and the honest broker as it as it were. So, parent-child communication has to be really clear. Would you say then if your child's been exposed, you wanna work with a therapist or a counselor? Because they'll be able to get to honesty maybe a little faster than mom and dad.[00:51:00]
Okay.
Speaker 6: Right. The kids really don't wanna open up to mom and dad and also mom and dad. You know, it's difficult for parents to be objective. They bring their own past, they bring their own story into this, and many times it just alarms them. And so work with a Christian therapist who's been trained to, to deal with this in a family system approach.
It's not that you have to step outside and leave the kid with a therapist. All of you can be involved.
Speaker 2: Right. I agree with that. Especially when they're younger and you want to be part of that healing process. Well, um, Rob, this is such an important topic, and of course we're just scratching the surface on this, but what I hear from you is positive and hopeful, because again, going back to the most powerful prevention is.
Bonding and that bonding. And if you don't feel attached or your kid pulls away because it is the job of a kid to individuate, they need to separate, but they do come back. I can attest to that. We have kids who've grown, graduated, married, we've got grandkids. But in that process, parents need to stay connected.
And I think that's a, a challenge [00:52:00] for all of us to do. Do you have, um, some material that focus on the family where they can go to and get more help for this?
Speaker 6: Absolutely. The first thing I would do is just recommend our website, focus on the family.com. But if you wanna go ahead and reach out to one of our counselors here on the team, you can call 800 a family and we'll be glad to serve you.
We're here from 6:00 AM to 8:00 PM Mountain Standard Time, Monday through Friday.
Speaker 2: You know, I'm so grateful for that, Rob. I can't tell you how many times we've talked about that on this show because people feel so lost if they, you know, we have a show about something and then they don't know where to go.
And I'm just so grateful for focus on the family's continual mission. And I know this mission is actually something that Dr. Dobson began with years ago when he was on the commission with President Reagan at the time. And it has continued to be a priority for Focus on the Family. Well, listen, Rob Jackson, great having you with us.
I so appreciate your help and everyone else take this issue serious. And let's be intentional and let's be preventing where we can and repairing where we have those steps over the [00:53:00] boundaries, and ultimately, God is a God of forgiveness, and we need to live out that pattern as well. Rob, thank you for your time today.
Speaker 6: Oh, it's my joy.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Carrie. Thank you so much and everyone else. We'll see you next time.
Speaker: You've been listening to the Carrie Abbott Show. If you'd like to listen again to today's episode or share it with a friend. Simply go to the legacy institute.com and remember, the Carey Abbott Show is made possible by donations from friends like you and of course, our tax deductible.
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